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 Post subject: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggestions
PostPosted: Thu Aug 21, 2014 11:40 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:33 am
Posts: 1494
Location: Australia
So far I have only been through the Preferences dialogues, but thought I'd post this before it got too old. I've attached a .pdf which has screendumps and is much more nicely formatted than the text below.


Attachment:


GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggestions

Testing version: GNS3 Early Release (ER) version 1.0beta2.dev1 on linux.

**Problem**
Edit | Preferences
General [General]
Configuration file
Clicking on [Export] opens a file browser entitled "Import configuration file"
This is confusing
It should read "Export configuration file"


**Suggestion**
Edit | Preferences
General [General]
General [Console applications]
General [Topology View]
Many other parts of "Preferences" have a [Restore Defaults] button
It would be nice to have one here too – on all three tabs

**Question**
Edit | Preferences
General [General]
My Projects:/
My binary images:

The default path for projects/images is $HOME/GNS3/projects and $HOME/GNS3/images [lowercase]
In previous versions of GNS3 it has always been $HOME/GNS3/Projects and $HOME/GNS3/Images [Titlecase]

Was this a deliberate attempt to distinguish between the old GNS3 and the new? Or just an accident that you didn't follow the same convention?

I rather like the idea of having it slightly different, because the new file format is so different.
**Question**
Edit | Preferences
Dynamips [Advanced settings]
[x] Allocate a new hypervisor for each device

The default is to have this option set (on)
It seems to me to defeat the purpose of running a hypervisor at all if there is only going to be one device per hypervisor.
Why have you decided that this is the best option? I had (on v0.8.6) changed my settings so the whole topology would run on a single hypervisor usually (by giving it 20MiB memory limit)

**Question/Suggestion**
Edit | Preferences
Dynamips [Advanced settings]
[x] Enable mmap support

I don't really understand mmap usage, but it seems as though no one would ever change it. Does it really need to be an option at all? (I guess it is under [Advanced settings])


**Big Problem**
Edit | Preferences
IOS Routers [IOS images]
also
IOU Devices [IOU images]

<note>I'm impressed that the default location to look for IOS images is in the IOS directory and IOU images in the IOU directory</note>

If I add an image, [Save] it but then hit [Cancel] - there is no warning that my settings will be lost.


[Update] – This problem is not unique to this screen. It applied for ALL settings – so I could have tweaked a dozen settings in different area (General; GNS3 server; Dynamips; IOS routers…) and hot cancel – BANG all gone!!! (The x (close window) action is exactly the same)

Here is how I think it should go:

In General:
Whenever a user makes a change in any setting area (General; GNS3 server; Packet capture; Cloud; Dynamips; IOS routers…) and moves away from that setting by clicking another setting, the settings are automatically applied. No questions. Similarly, if user makes a change under any tab in any setting area and moves to another tab, the settings are automatically applied. No questions.

The [Cancel] button is removed from the outer pane and added to each individual pane that has settings that can be cancelled. (Next to the [Restore Defaults]). Pressing [Cancel] should simply put the settings back to what they were when the tab was opened. There may be some tabs that don't warrant a [Cancel] or [Restore defaults] buttons

In particular for the IOS on routers [IOS images] and IOS on Unix [IOU images] panes:

When first opened, the pane would have only one option available [Add image]. The [Delete] and [Decompress] options would appear greyed out until an image was selected from the list.

* Note: the same would apply when adding IOU devices – only the button would be [Add device] rather than [Add image] and there would be no [Decompress] option.

Note there is no [Cancel] option anywhere at this stage

[Aside: I have often wondered why we use the word "Uncompress" rather than the correct word "Decompress" – and I guess it is because we "unzip" "zipped" files. Anyway, I have used "Decompress", because I used to be a school teacher and I'm pedantic about these things]

From here, one of two things can happen: (1) [Add image] is selected, or (2) the user selects an existing image from the list of images.


(1) If [Add image] is selected, the Select an IOS image dialogue is opened immediately.

If [Cancel] is clicked at this point, go back to previous state.

When an image is selected and [Open]ed, the bottom half of the pane becomes available, with [Save] and [Cancel] options

The user will have to complete the
Chassis: and
Idle-PC: values…

If [Cancel] is presses at this stage, then return to the previous state.

If [Save] is selected, then the image is added to the list above, and an automatic [Apply] is done to actually save the information. Then the screen returns to the previous state, but with the extra image listed, as shown in possibility (2) the user selects an existing image from the list of images shown below


(2) If the user selects an existing image from the list of images, then the [Delete] and [Decompress] options appear


Note there is no [Cancel] option anywhere at this stage

* Note: the same would apply when adding IOU devices – only the button would be [Add device] rather than [Add image] and there would be no [Decompress] option.



**Comment/Question**
Edit | Preferences
IOS Routers [IOS images]


Startup-config: Default value: $HOME/.python-eggs/gns3_gui-1.0beta2.dev1-py3.4.egg-tmp/gns3/configs/ios_base_startup-config.txt

This used to be in the "images" directory. I would have thought that the logical place to put it would now be the "images/IOS" directory
Is this intended new default, or is it going to be changed?







**Small Bug**
Edit | Preferences

Port ranges:
The spreadsheet below shows a couple of overlapping port ranges:
Code:
Server         Prot    Start     End Port
Dynamips Console      TCP    2,001     2,500
Dynamips AUX         TCP    2,501     3,000
VB Console         TCP    3,501     4,000
IOU Console         TCP    4,001     *4,512*
VPCS Console         TCP    *4,512*     5,000
Dynamips Server      TCP    7,200     7,210
GNS3 Server         TCP    8,000     8,010
Dynamips UDP Tunnel   UDP    10,001     20,000
VPCS UDP Tunnel      UDP    20,001     20,512
IOU UDP Tunnel      UDP    30,001     *40,000*
VB UDP Tunnel         UDP    *35,001*     35,512


Suggest that IUO Console end at TCP port 4500, VPCS Console start at 4501, and IOU UDP Tunnel port range end at 35000



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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:23 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:33 am
Posts: 1494
Location: Australia
Continued on topic11734.html

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Mon Aug 25, 2014 9:28 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 1:41 pm
Posts: 2668
Location: Canada
Hi Chris,

Quote:
**Problem**
Edit | Preferences
General [General]
Configuration file
Clicking on [Export] opens a file browser entitled "Import configuration file"
This is confusing
It should read "Export configuration file"


Fixed.

Quote:
**Suggestion**
Edit | Preferences
General [General]
General [Console applications]
General [Topology View]
Many other parts of "Preferences" have a [Restore Defaults] button
It would be nice to have one here too – on all three tabs


I've added "restore defaults" buttons on the capture and general panes. However for the general one, the button will restore default settings on all three tabs. This is also the way it works on other multi-tabbed panes.

Quote:
**Question**
Edit | Preferences
General [General]
My Projects:/
My binary images:

The default path for projects/images is $HOME/GNS3/projects and $HOME/GNS3/images [lowercase]
In previous versions of GNS3 it has always been $HOME/GNS3/Projects and $HOME/GNS3/Images [Titlecase]

Was this a deliberate attempt to distinguish between the old GNS3 and the new? Or just an accident that you didn't follow the same convention?

I rather like the idea of having it slightly different, because the new file format is so different.


It was more like an accident ;) I'll keep them lowercase then.

Quote:
**Question**
Edit | Preferences
Dynamips [Advanced settings]
[x] Allocate a new hypervisor for each device

The default is to have this option set (on)
It seems to me to defeat the purpose of running a hypervisor at all if there is only going to be one device per hypervisor.
Why have you decided that this is the best option? I had (on v0.8.6) changed my settings so the whole topology would run on a single hypervisor usually (by giving it 20MiB memory limit)


Well the reason behind that is you can easily crash Dynamips when trying to run multiple IOSes on one instance if you are not careful. Also, it is much easier to debug and manage when you have 1 IOS = 1 Dynamips hypervisor. So yes why still use an hypervisor? Because more commands are supported in the hypervisor mode and it allows you to dynamically apply settings too. The bonus is that only 1 router is gone if Dynamips do crash.

Quote:
**Question/Suggestion**
Edit | Preferences
Dynamips [Advanced settings]
[x] Enable mmap support

I don't really understand mmap usage, but it seems as though no one would ever change it. Does it really need to be an option at all? (I guess it is under [Advanced settings])


You are right, I wouldn't recommend to change this setting nor I would expect someone to change it but it's there for "what if?" and other debugging purposes. For instance, I recently found out that the sparse memory settings would prevent c1700 and c2600 images to be restarted. I was able to validate this is GNS3 because the option was there.

This is the all idea being advanced settings, you can touch but don't complain if it doesn't work after ;)

Quote:
**Big Problem**
Edit | Preferences
IOS Routers [IOS images]
also
IOU Devices [IOU images]

<note>I'm impressed that the default location to look for IOS images is in the IOS directory and IOU images in the IOU directory</note>

If I add an image, [Save] it but then hit [Cancel] - there is no warning that my settings will be lost.


There is definitely room for improvement here. I'll need some time to rethink everything.

Quote:
* Note: the same would apply when adding IOU devices – only the button would be [Add device] rather than [Add image] and there would be no [Decompress] option.


Uncompress is apparently used a lot (type it in Google), however I agree decompress is the correct word. I changed that now :)

Quote:
**Comment/Question**
Edit | Preferences
IOS Routers [IOS images]


Startup-config: Default value: $HOME/.python-eggs/gns3_gui-1.0beta2.dev1-py3.4.egg-tmp/gns3/configs/ios_base_startup-config.txt

This used to be in the "images" directory. I would have thought that the logical place to put it would now be the "images/IOS" directory
Is this intended new default, or is it going to be changed?


Right now it is intended to be the new default. One issue if we have base configs in the "images/IOS" directory is that users will change them and next time they install GNS3, their configs get overwritten. Still some thinking to do about this...

Quote:
**Small Bug**
Edit | Preferences

Port ranges:
The spreadsheet below shows a couple of overlapping port ranges:


Fixed.

Thanks for all these suggestions, definitely very helpful.

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 2:02 am 
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Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 1:41 pm
Posts: 2668
Location: Canada
Quote:
Here is how I think it should go:

In General:
Whenever a user makes a change in any setting area (General; GNS3 server; Packet capture; Cloud; Dynamips; IOS routers…) and moves away from that setting by clicking another setting, the settings are automatically applied. No questions. Similarly, if user makes a change under any tab in any setting area and moves to another tab, the settings are automatically applied. No questions.

The [Cancel] button is removed from the outer pane and added to each individual pane that has settings that can be cancelled. (Next to the [Restore Defaults]). Pressing [Cancel] should simply put the settings back to what they were when the tab was opened. There may be some tabs that don't warrant a [Cancel] or [Restore defaults] buttons



I've looked at how other software (randomly: Eclipse, PyCharm and LibreOffice) handle their user preferences and they have the same behaviour as GNS3. For instance, in LibreOffice go to Tools -> Options -> LibreOffice Base -> Databases and change the name of one of the default database. Click on Cancel, come back and notice the name hasn't been saved. Also, if you navigate between tab/preferences and make changes, they are not applied until you click on Ok or Apply.

So I am a bit confused, what should be the standard way to handle preferences? Can someone point me out to a software that I could use as a reference?

Btw, I've done some improvements on the preferences dialog. You should sync with the latest dev version to check that out.

Thanks,

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:27 am 
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Joined: Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:29 pm
Posts: 40
Maybe place the VMs into a separate Window? One without an "Apply" and "OK" buttons, where "Save" also equals "Apply", and the only tabs are IOS, Qemu, VirtualBox... And IOU I guess. Each tab's "Save" button would independently add that VM into the list.

[edit]On second though, perhaps it would be simpler to have a dedicated menu item in "Edit" (let's say called "Devices"), with submenu items for each VM type, including IOS and IOU, with each opening a Window that contains the respective settings.[/edit]

As a reference application, you can take any one where there's no tabs. Where each section on the left corresponds to a single window OR any application with a single window (no sections on the left) and multiple tabs.

The difficulty with section+tabs interfaces is exactly in the fact that for many people, it's counter intuitive to grasp the "nested" nature of it (that each "tab" is nested in a section, and that sections are nested in the window, and that some buttons apply only on one level or the other, but that you need to apply the whole window before you're REALLY done). It was difficult for me at first too (as in, the first few hours...), but I've adapted to it already. I can see how it could be even more difficult for others though.


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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:27 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:33 am
Posts: 1494
Location: Australia
Quote:
For instance, in LibreOffice go to Tools -> Options -> LibreOffice Base -> Databases and change the name of one of the default database. Click on Cancel, come back and notice the name hasn't been saved.


You are correct. I just tried it. But the key difference here is NOWHERE in that sequence did I click SAVE.

Compare that to:
GNS3v1b4dev1 - Preferences |< Dyamips|>IOS Routers|[IOS images] tab, click the IOS path ellipsis [...], select a file, click [Open] click [Save] then click [Cancel]. Bang! All Gone - my Save action was totally meaningless.

And of course, in the old IOS and hypervisors model, once you had clicked Save, your settings were saved.

Now I accept that there are various standards as to whether things are saved or not when you move from tab-to-tab or choice-to-choice in these kinds of interfaces, but I would argue that in 2014, the trend is towards automatically saving once set. This has partly been driven by handheld devices, probably most notably Apple iOS devices, and in fact reflects the philosophy of Apple in general (I don't want to get into an Apple vs the-rest-of-the-world argument here, just theorising how I think this started).

So if I go to my Apple Settings (ie System Preferences) and say choose Dock
Attachment:
AppleDockPrefs.png
AppleDockPrefs.png [ 66.8 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

Any adjustment here is so immediate that I can see it on the screen. There is no Save, and no Cancel options even given! And I think you'll find these kinds of interfaces are becoming more common. I'm not saying we use it as a model, I'm just illustrating a trend (For a NON Apple example of this trend, take the Open Office Preferences mentioned by Jeremy. Under Advanced, Click [Add and add another JRE instance. Once added - it's done and dusted - clicking [Cancel after doing the Add does NOT remove what you have just added - quite different to GNS3)

But back to GNS3 and the Preferences pane.

I think the key issue is that I don't like users having to click both Save AND then also click Apply - or more precisely, that if they click Save and then Cancel there is no warning! In fact, the whole [Save] - [Apply] - [OK] terminology is a little confusing. On one screen I can see [Apply] appearing TWICE plus a [Save] and an [OK] (See GNS3 Preferences |<QEMU->QEMU VMs|>[QEMU VMs] tab)

Attachment:
QEMUPrefs.png
QEMUPrefs.png [ 104.33 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]


For inspiration, I looked at another Apple preference that more closely resembles adding an image - in this case, adding a network interface.

To do this I open System Preferences and choose Network, then say click the + to add an interface. You'll note that I don't even get a Save option - I get an even more affirmative Create option. Note also, that the dialogue to add the interface is an additional dialogue - not part of the main pane.
Attachment:
OSXCreateInterface.png
OSXCreateInterface.png [ 111.03 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]


And once I've "Created" that interface, I can now configure it - but note that there is also a big Revert button - and NO Cancel button - although clicking [Show All], the "Back" icon or the "close" button amount to Cancel.
Attachment:
OSXConfigureInterface.png
OSXConfigureInterface.png [ 100.11 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

But here's the big difference. If I DO click [Show All], the "Back" icon or the "close" button, then I see this:
Attachment:
OSXSettingWarning.png
OSXSettingWarning.png [ 72.25 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

A big warning that my settings will be lost

[Note: It is now 24 hrs since I wrote the previous bit, and have looked at many Preferences from many Applications, but for this model, I'm going to stick with Jeremy's reference to Open Office (aka Libre Office) Databases example.]

So how about this for a plan B. In pictures
Attachment:
File comment: Here is Libre Office Preferences and a mock-up of a new GNS3 Preferences, modelled on Libre Office. Note that the detail has gone, and there are just three buttons [New] (which may be better as [Add]??) [Delete] and [Cancel]- just like Libre Office
Preferences1.png
Preferences1.png [ 114.84 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: After clicking [New] (or [Add]??), you would see the details window, with [Browse] buttons - Like Libre Office
PreferencesNew.png
PreferencesNew.png [ 138.93 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: Clicking [Browse] would allow you to select your image as you'd expect
BrowseForImage.png
BrowseForImage.png [ 257.07 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: After selecting your image, you'd be able to edit the other settings if desired. This dialogue would also be what you see if you were to click the [Edit] button when an image is selected on the main screen.
Adding-EditingImageFile.png
Adding-EditingImageFile.png [ 148.33 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]

Attachment:
File comment: After Saving, you'd be back at the main dialogue, with the [New] [Delete] [Edit] options again. With one BIG change from Libre Office. Clicking [Cancel] on Libre Office does indeed throw away your settings

I'd like to think that clicking Cancel in GNS3 would be more like the Apple model -ALWAYS warn if you are throwing away unsaved changes

AfterSaving.png
AfterSaving.png [ 135.35 KiB | Viewed 6411 times ]


Hopefully this is more acceptable. Mind you, it is not a lot different to what I suggested before, except that the Editing of the settings is in a separate dialogue.

Here are some of the things I like about it:
  1. It forces the user to click [New] (or [Add]) to add an image. This is SOOOO much better than what we have now. Here's me explaining over someone's shoulder how to use the current system:

    "Well actually this is what you have to do to add an image - see those three dots - you know, the ellipsis - no not THOSE three dots - the other set of three dots - the ones near 'IOS Path' - you have to click those. Now select an image...etc"
  2. The separate dialogue removes the [Save] button - now you get to hit [OK] when you are done configuring/editing the image settings

One final point:
I've just realised that in all my pictures above I've put the [Decompress] option in the Edit dialogue. This is not the right place to do this.

The [Decompress] button should be in the main selection screen, and if clicked while a compressed image is selected, the image should be decomressed and the Edit dialogue opened with the decompressed image details ready for editing.

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Mon Oct 06, 2014 6:15 pm 
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Joined: Sat Oct 11, 2008 1:41 pm
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Hi Chris,

Quote:
Hopefully this is more acceptable. Mind you, it is not a lot different to what I suggested before, except that the Editing of the settings is in a separate dialogue.


Yep it is. Actually, I've had started some work on the Qemu VM preferences before you post ;) I've mostly applied your suggestions with some improvements like the wizard dialog when you add a new device.

Only thing I am not 100% satisfied of is how to show the VM/device settings? I've tried to show all the settings for a selected VM (see below) but maybe I should keep it simple like it was previously?

Attachment:
qemu_vm_settings.png
qemu_vm_settings.png [ 74.77 KiB | Viewed 6383 times ]


I intend to do the same for IOS, IOU and VirtualBox VM preferences once set on the look and feel of Qemu VM preferences.

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Thu Oct 09, 2014 10:13 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:33 am
Posts: 1494
Location: Australia
@Jeremy

Sorry for the slow reply.

I've spent a bit of time trying to make sense of the QEMU interface. As it is in beta4.dev1 it is pretty hard to work out, so your development picture looks a lot better than the existing system.

Quote:
I've tried to show all the settings for a selected VM


I think it is important to keep ALL the settings for the VM visible, so the graphic looks better than the beta4.dev1 version where you NEED to go to the Advanced tab to get an ASA working.

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2014 3:36 am 
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@rednectar

Hey Chris,

You can already start to play with the new look and feel for the preferences (1.0-beta4.dev2). This is not yet completed and need some more tweaking but most of it is there and you will notice how much more everything has improved already ;)

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 Post subject: Re: GNS3 v1.0 b2 Problems, Questions, Comments, and Suggesti
PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2014 10:41 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 11:33 am
Posts: 1494
Location: Australia
@Jeremy.

Something is broken when I try to update

Code:
[email protected] ~/GNS3/source/gns3-gui $ git pull origin master
From git://github.com/GNS3/gns3-gui
* branch            master     -> FETCH_HEAD
Already up-to-date.
[email protected] ~/GNS3/source/gns3-gui $ sudo python3 setup.py install
running install
Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "setup.py", line 74, in <module>
    "Programming Language :: Python :: Implementation :: CPython",
  File "/usr/lib/python3.4/distutils/core.py", line 148, in setup
    dist.run_commands()
  File "/usr/lib/python3.4/distutils/dist.py", line 955, in run_commands
    self.run_command(cmd)
  File "/usr/lib/python3.4/distutils/dist.py", line 974, in run_command
    cmd_obj.run()
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.4/dist-packages/setuptools/command/install.py", line 67, in run
    self.do_egg_install()
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.4/dist-packages/setuptools/command/install.py", line 98, in do_egg_install
    easy_install = self.distribution.get_command_class('easy_install')
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.4/dist-packages/setuptools/dist.py", line 388, in get_command_class
    self.cmdclass[command] = cmdclass = ep.load()
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/pkg_resources.py", line 2088, in load
    entry = __import__(self.module_name, globals(),globals(), ['__name__'])
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.4/dist-packages/setuptools/command/easy_install.py", line 42, in <module>
    from setuptools.archive_util import unpack_archive
  File "/usr/local/lib/python3.4/dist-packages/setuptools/archive_util.py", line 15, in <module>
    from pkg_resources import ensure_directory, ContextualZipFile
ImportError: cannot import name 'ContextualZipFile'


Any clues as to why I can't run sudo python3 setup.py install?



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